Fec Boris tee shirt you can be arrested for wearing one

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FrenchForumSurvivor
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Re: Fec Boris tee shirt you can be arrested for wearing one

Post by FrenchForumSurvivor »

bluebird wrote:
Sat Jun 06, 2020 11:20 pm
All said and done, have the police really nothing better to do? Folk are still being stabbed, raped, mugged etc. In having a go at someone wearing a tee shirt, the idiotic police could be accused of going for the 'low hanging fruit' in terms of everyday offences.
The police police: "To enforce the law and keep order among (a group)" or "To enforce norms or standards upon". In this particular instance they were BTP, so a limited purview, but I'm pretty sure that if, while they were discussing a tee-shirt with someone, they noticed someone being "stabbed, raped, mugged etc" then they would have reacted accordingly.
"I am a man of fixed and unbending principles, the first of which is to be flexible at all times." - Everett Dirksen

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Re: Fec Boris tee shirt you can be arrested for wearing one

Post by bluebird »

FrenchForumSurvivor wrote:
Sun Jun 07, 2020 10:23 am
bluebird wrote:
Sat Jun 06, 2020 11:20 pm
All said and done, have the police really nothing better to do? Folk are still being stabbed, raped, mugged etc. In having a go at someone wearing a tee shirt, the idiotic police could be accused of going for the 'low hanging fruit' in terms of everyday offences.
The police police: "To enforce the law and keep order among (a group)" or "To enforce norms or standards upon". In this particular instance they were BTP, so a limited purview, but I'm pretty sure that if, while they were discussing a tee-shirt with someone, they noticed someone being "stabbed, raped, mugged etc" then they would have reacted accordingly.
Debatable.

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Re: Fec Boris tee shirt you can be arrested for wearing one

Post by Flaneur »

Hmm.

I spent a lot of my professional life arguing with police officers, but I never met one who'd avoid doing the right thing in that sort of situation. We can argue about officiousness, but not about public-spiritedness.

(Apart from the Met officer-turned-barrister who claimed that, in the 80s, they'd be slow to a ruck and hope they'd sorted out their differences before the police arrived.)
Same old nonsense.

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Re: Fec Boris tee shirt you can be arrested for wearing one

Post by bluebird »

Yes possibly, but essentially, the police or BTP are wasting time and money arguing the toss about whether or not a tee shirt is offensive when they could be doing something worthwhile. Otherwise the authorities should notify the public that the police are going to be taking offensive tee shirt wearing very seriously and will be clamping down on it.

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Re: Fec Boris tee shirt you can be arrested for wearing one

Post by Le Démerdeur »

If I were wearing the T shirt, which I wouldn't, they would not be wasting time arguing the toss because had they asked me to zip up my coat to cover it whilst travelling on their train I would have complied and not filmed them, asked them what law I was breaking, argued etc.

But then I have been in France a long time and know that challenging someones authority is not going to end well, I may ask politely for clarification then thank them and then return home to check the law and find they were wrong.

Often I know I am being fed a crock of **** but no point making an issue of it, there is only going to be one loser.

Editted, there may be some assumptions in the above, I could only read a few lines of the article before a pop up blocked the rest and have gone on what was said on here.

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Re: Fec Boris tee shirt you can be arrested for wearing one

Post by bluebird »

As you say LD, you probably wouldn't be wearing one and would be compliant to cover up. Thing is, if the police are going down this route they will be very busy indeed, attempting to deal with such trivia which is actually quite common in 2020. Lot's of people wear similar stuff, they can get it printed at kiosks all over the UK. The policing wouldn't be easy, deciding what is offensive and illegal, or borderline offensive, or tongue in cheek etc etc. I ask the question, is it really that important ??

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Re: Fec Boris tee shirt you can be arrested for wearing one

Post by Le Démerdeur »

To whom?

To me yes, I find it offensive, others not.

Is it important to use manpower to enforce it? A more tricky question and thankfully one that would not arise in this country.

I cling to the belief that displaying those words in the public domain is illegal because you just dont see them, maybe I am wrong but in a society where limits of decency seem to be a goal to exceed then I think that there must be a law, the French Connection advertising campaign or Mystys choice of title seems to be as far as things go in the public domain.

And I repeat its the two swear words in question that my minority of one object to (in public view) not the sentiment expressed or the recipent.

I made it clear that I was going to protest at the inaugauration of my road with a printed T shirt in front of the regional press, the Iière adjoint and other members of the C.M. saw it and fed it back to the now deposed Maire and he caved in the day before to their relief, it was nothing contenscious it simply said

(name of my village) DEMOCRACIE (sic) OU DICTATURE? to my shame I misspelled démocratie :oops:

On the day I decided to wear it under my proper shirt just to keep him on edge, he had got 5 gendarmes to attend and at the point of the cutting of the ribbon when all the photos were taken 2 of them squeezed up beside me like a vice pinning my arms to my side the others gathered behind with menottes at the ready :lol:

Had I actually tried anything I would have been efficiently immobilised and quietly led away, no question of them asking me nicely to put my shirt back on and then answering my questions while I filmed them :lol:

After the Storm

Re: Fec Boris tee shirt you can be arrested for wearing one

Post by After the Storm »

Flaneur wrote:
Sat Jun 06, 2020 11:02 pm
I do admire the way you back yourself into a corner and still refuse to give up, AtS!

I think you are right that an offence contrary to s. 5 of the 1986 Act was not committed - but I do think that the BTP officer acted properly and within the principles of policing by consent.
FrenchForumSurvivor wrote:
Sat Jun 06, 2020 11:14 pm
[quote="After the Storm" post_id=157543 time=<a href="tel:1591476430">1591476430</a> user_id=49]
Interesting the accusation of being misleading considering i said "I am not a police officer or lawyer so if I have got the sections of the Public Order Act wrong below, no problem just tell me and I will correct it." Funny I said "sections" plural, so why the attack FFS with you claiming I implied they were both from Section 5.
Also I asked that if I had it wrong to let me know so I could correct it.

Thanks guys, I am now out of here, those that claim to be offended by the word f*** think nothing of making accusations and turning something that has nothing to do with personal opinions as such made it personal rather than on the letter of the law.
FFFS said “Whether you intended it or not, the posting of the one screenshot following the other implied that the two were related, which they are not. As you asked, I said you were mistaken, I didn't say you were misleading. And I'm not offended by the word, never said I was, but as you said somewhere earlier, we were talking about the law and if we're talking about the law it's useful to get it right.”

I was not being misleading nor mistaken and neither was I implying anything. I took a screen shot so if those sections were not what I should be looking at for the info about the act then someone could correct me and point me in the right direction. I certainly don’t understand what irked you so much about them but finding myself defending or explaining screenshots I didn’t find very clever of you if that was your intention. Debating what the Act was meant to be for would have been far more interesting.
After the Storm wrote:
Sat Jun 06, 2020 10:37 pm
FrenchForumSurvivor wrote:
Sat Jun 06, 2020 10:16 pm
After the Storm wrote:
Sat Jun 06, 2020 9:07 pm
:roll: FFS, the talk on here has been of section 5 and generally of the Public Order Act hence 2 photos that refer to words said or written.
Except that the second photo has nothing to do with section 5, so it's misleading to imply it does. FFS.
Rather than accusing me of being misleading, go back and show me how I was being misleading. I didn’t say what you are saying, they are screen shots, one had a heading the other didn’t, I didn’t give them headings.
Flaneur What am I meant to give up on? Backed into a corner on what? What corner do you think you 2 put me in? I found you and FFS responses to what I wrote incomprehensible You asked a totally irrelevant question which I ignored the first time but then when you put the question the second time about what would I do if blokes were swearing, I answered in a good natured way for you to then tell me it wasn’t all about me! You and FFS put me off posting again on this thread so as I said before, well done. The screen shots were neither misleading nor mistaken but just screenshots out of the police bible not the beano and already explained why I put them up. Talking about the public order act would have been more interesting and why I then gave a link when the amendments of different sections of the Act were discussed whence my use of the word 'trivial' came from.

Edit. This post and the one below are messy, but too difficult to edit and no time either.

After the Storm

Re: Fec Boris tee shirt you can be arrested for wearing one

Post by After the Storm »

FrenchForumSurvivor wrote:
Sat Jun 06, 2020 11:14 pm
After the Storm wrote:
Sat Jun 06, 2020 10:47 pm
Interesting the accusation of being misleading considering i said "I am not a police officer or lawyer so if I have got the sections of the Public Order Act wrong below, no problem just tell me and I will correct it." Funny I said "sections" plural, so why the attack FFS with you claiming I implied they were both from Section 5.
Also I asked that if I had it wrong to let me know so I could correct it.

Thanks guys, I am now out of here, those that claim to be offended by the word fuck think nothing of making accusations and turning something that has nothing to do with personal opinions as such made it personal rather than on the letter of the law.
Whether you intended it or not, the posting of the one screenshot following the other implied that the two were related, which they are not. As you asked, I said you were mistaken, I didn't say you were misleading. And I'm not offended by the word, never said I was, but as you said somewhere earlier, we were talking about the law and if we're talking about the law it's useful to get it right.
You say you didn’t use the word “misleading” and yet you said “Except that the second photo has nothing to do with section 5, so it's misleading to imply it does. FFS.”
So I will say it again I was not being misleading! Neither was I implying anything but put up screenshots regarding the Act, I was trying to be helpful, not sure what the point is of what you were doing was other than just putting someone off from posting anymore.

Might have been better to have asked ""Ats could you see what order those screenshots went up or did you just upload both at the same time because it didn't make any difference how they appeared as anyone could have done what you did and gone and looked for themselves considering they were out of the police bible and not the beano which you went and looked up after the Public Order Act had been mentioned as an all encompassing Act".

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Re: Fec Boris tee shirt you can be arrested for wearing one

Post by Le Démerdeur »

There was a chap in Action today with his wife and young children, his T shirt had one single word on it in capital letters, the F word, about 4" long and 1" high repeated from side to side and top to bottom, on the front and back, sleeves, every scrap of material, not even 1/4" between the words or each line.

It saddened me :(

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